PCS lighting

[idodishez]

For those that do UPB based lighting, or even more specifically PCS/Pulseworx lighting, Im curious to see if this is just me. I gotta say I’ve had issue after issue, and I'm surprised if no one else has.

The PIM serial module doesn’t always “take” on the programming. Initially, I was having several issues with the USB version of the module. So someone finally suggested I switch to a serial version, as apparentlythere were possible issues w the USB version. I am now using the serial version, and still having issues. Example: I can have a system file completed in UPStart. I will go to “program all”, and let it do its thing. When it gets done, I assume it’s just that, DONE. But on numerous occasions I have (after wasting hours of pulling hair) found that ALL the programming did not take. If I do a “verify all”, I come up with many differences between the system file and the lighting system. Mind you this was after I had already tested the loads for the proper response, only to find that most of the loads or links were not responding properly. So, I ended up MANUALLY programming each individual device in the lighting system. Then I will do another “verify all”, and eventually get a match between the system file and the lighting system. From here, I test all loads and scenes again.
I also have several issues with the lamp modules not always responding. Specifically the LM1 modules. They only respond about 60% of the time however, or often do the opposite of what they’re supposed to. (An ALL OFF scene will actually turn ON some of the LM1’s.)



Now, this is the first PCS system Ive done, so take all this w a grain of salt. But I HAVE been working with it on and off (no pun intended) for over a year now.



Brad, I know you do PCS. Any similar issues?



There are other issues that have arose when integrating w HomeLogic, but Ill post this in the HL thread.

[sanfransoxfan04]

I have 10 simple dimmers, 1 universal dimmer and 4 lamp modules. They are the cheaper versions you can find at Frys with the exception of the Universal which is from the Simply Automated Demo Kit. Using 2x RS-232 PIMs, one for programming, the other connected to a Crestron Pro2 for control.

I have not had the problems you describe. Make sure you are using the latest version of UPSTART which I think is version 4.5 Build 56. Are all your devices on the same phase or are you using a coupler?

I have found Simply Automated tech support to be friendly and helpful.

[Matt]

Brad, I know you do PCS. Any similar issues?






Your probibly going to have to pick up the phone to get an answer from him..... :(

[idodishez]

Your probibly going to have to pick up the phone to get an answer from him..... :(

This thread was actually pre RIP/Brad. But yes, now I will.

[Pyro]

I've done a few large systems (40-50+ devices) and I have had my share of issues, but not so much with the PIM. I've only ever used the serial version and from time to time, if I unplug it from one outlet to move accross the house, and plug up to another outlet, I may have to go as far as rebooting the computer and restart Upstart in order to get comm back with the PIM. I always program onsite from the beginning and program each device as I go, so, if a problem develops, I know pretty quick and havn't wasted a bunch of time.

Jean Wilson at PCS is always great to talk to and has even come in 3 hours early to help me deal with a problem just because I'm on the east coast.

For the most part, the only issues I have consistantly are with noise or lack of signal. If my typing didn't suck so bad, I could write a book. Call me if you want to know more. 770.891.3697

Rich

[Second Banana]

I have done a few UPB systems, and I use HAIs serial pim. I have noticed that same problem. I too had to program each switch to get rid if the differences on the network.

[Second Banana]

I also had a problem last month with a pim from HAI, the pim would not program a switch, but it would control a programmed switch just fine.

[IHT]

I also had a problem last month with a pim from HAI, the pim would not program a switch, but it would control a programmed switch just fine.

HAI PIM's use "message mode" when communicating from the controller, and "pulse mode" when communicating from UpStart. You need to reset the mode on the PIM when switching between controller use and UpStart use.

Ken McLeod
Integrated Home Technologies

[Second Banana]

Yes, I am aware of that. I should have mentioned that in my post. It is a problem that I obsereved in a condo which cost a lot of trouble shooting time, on my end and HAI's end. The funny thing is, PIM programmed the first switch, then nothing else.

[starecase]

I've used the Simply Automated switches and never had these issues other than when there was extraneous noise on the line from a low-voltage fixture or something.

[Ghost]

Jean Wilson at PCS is always great to talk to and has even come in 3 hours early to help me deal with a problem just because I'm on the east coast.
For what it's worth - Jean is no longer with PCS. I saw it coming as I knew what was going on. I hope I don't get treated like a second class citizen by the new people they have in place or I'll be done with UPB systems.

As much as the UPB manufactures like to play up their system. It DOES have the same issues you had to deal with X10 (it is powerline based after all). You need to design your system properly from the start. Always use a UPB phase coupler (may even need a repeater). And always spec at least 1 noise filter in (incase you need it).
If you follow the worse case scenario on your designs, you're not likely to run into too may problems and have a system that's 99%+ reliable.

As far as complex.
PCS is easy to install & setup real fast with a small system, even with some complex features. But its problem shows when you start expanding the system to large. When you get up to over a hundred devices and/or scenes - the UPStart program really becomes a beast. They need a better way to navigate the program and make changes.

[Ghost]

UpStart version 5.0 build 1 was just made avaliable for download yesterday.

Features:

Added full support for new PulseWorx products:
WS1X Wall Switch – Mark 10 Dimmer Added BETA support for future PulseWorx products:

RFI – RF Interface Base
TPR – Three-Phase RepeaterAdded support for the adjustment of Status LED brightness on new versions of the WS1D, WS1E, & WS1X. Detect and report the loss of the powerline interface.
General enhancements:

Added new Toolbar buttons. Dialogs for Add Links & Delete Links no longer close automatically. Phase now part of the printout and displayed on the Device ID tab. Firmware version now part of the printout. Improvements to PulseWorx KPC LED Presets interface.
Added "Copy Links" button and "Clear" button.
Clear LED selections when link changes to "Unused".Many improvements to the D2D Communications Test interface. Many improvements to the Link Communications Test interface.
Now shows Button Mode 1-tap/2-tap/hold/release actions in an easier to read manner.General bug fixes:

Corrected VLE problem with switch rockers. VLE wouldn't let you modify the mode of the transmit component. When setting a device to non-dim RCT table entries that are set for blink no longer get cleared. Fixed problems keeping the List View updated with some configuration and status changes.
Log viewer improvements to better decode Fade Start commands.
Changed descriptive text in the PCS OCM dialog to better show the timed auto shutoff range.

[Second Banana]

Ghost thanks for the update

[idodishez]

For what it's worth - Jean is no longer with PCS. I saw it coming as I knew what was going on. I hope I don't get treated like a second class citizen by the new people they have in place or I'll be done with UPB systems.

As much as the UPB manufactures like to play up their system. It DOES have the same issues you had to deal with X10 (it is powerline based after all). You need to design your system properly from the start. Always use a UPB phase coupler (may even need a repeater). And always spec at least 1 noise filter in (incase you need it).
If you follow the worse case scenario on your designs, you're not likely to run into too may problems and have a system that's 99%+ reliable.

As far as complex.
PCS is easy to install & setup real fast with a small system, even with some complex features. But its problem shows when you start expanding the system to large. When you get up to over a hundred devices and/or scenes - the UPStart program really becomes a beast. They need a better way to navigate the program and make changes.

Sounds like your still having better luck than I. I havent messed with the system in a while, but I am really second guessing my decision to make PCS a line I want.

[FRR]

Sounds like your still having better luck than I. I havent messed with the system in a while, but I am really second guessing my decision to make PCS a line I want.

I may sound like a cynic, but ANY PLC based lighting system is going to have re-occurring problems. PLC/UPB or any other company is in the same boat. Nothing like having multiple daisy chained communications busses with other installed devices that generate noise in the same frequency spectrum that your equipment works in. What's worse is that you have NO way of controlling these other devices or knowing when one will degrade or when one will be added.

All that and consumer expectations of a low cost system which usually means small margins.

For me, it's a DYI technology and always will be.

[Ghost]

Well I don't know about small margins - Public side, so can't post prices but I make double my money on all equipment (I don't go buy the new MSRP sheet which lowered profit).
So I make a good margin on my lighting.

As far as noise: The only problems I've ever had was a built-in microwave oven and a bad, cheap fluorescent light. Problem was easily solved with a filter on the microwave, and the other customer replaced the fluorescent light fixture.
Using UpStart, I can test the power line in the house for noise pretty well. I have either the customer or myself turn on & off anything electrical or electronic in the house to check for possible problems. Most things that generate noise on the power line, just don't generate enough to hurt the UPB's 50 volt signal.
Again: This is always using at least a coupler back at the panel. The signal is almost always to weak for my taste, if you don't bridge the phases together using at least a coupler for UPB signals (you'll have problems with signals - especially programming).
On really large homes or homes with other electrical challenges: If I see the signal is still kind of weak for my taste on the other phase, even with the coupler(s) - then I would install a repeater(s) instead of the coupler(s). Not had to do that yet however.

[Michael]

If you have not tried PCS Lighting with UPB in a while, let me know. We have made many technilogical changes that make the system better than ever.
Also, if you have any design or tech questions drop me a line. We are here to help with your experience.

[2ndRick]

Michael,
welcome to the forums, this is not all of it...

We will get your access straightened out and get you into the larger area for manufacturer members.

Thanks for joining.